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Old 12-09-2007, 07:40 AM   #21
Connor S.
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Default Re: How do we speed mafia up?

yes, but that means new host,s that could potentially be good ones, never get to host a game. I think we just need to revise the list- or give Wesleys ideea a try. I think that ha gret potential. It would completely cut the list in half! That way, maybe people can actually host within this
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Old 12-09-2007, 08:58 AM   #22
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Yerfdog Re: How do we speed mafia up?

Split the list in 2- A set of games for experienced players and a set of ones for inexperienced ones. Then the new players will still have a chance to win / learn how to play the game on their own, and the more experienced players won't have to fight with players that just bandwagon or lurk. This could help with Atkins' problems 2-4, as only experienced hosts could sign up for the experienced league list. Both lists would be smaller, although each game would probably have less players.
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Old 12-09-2007, 10:52 AM   #23
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Yerfdog Re: How do we speed mafia up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolguy View Post
It's more like 6 monthes.

1) Replace lurkers faster!
2) All hosts should visit at least every day.
3) Start the game at night.

I don't see much beyond that.
Those ideas seem pretty simple, but things like that could help a little. I'm not sure about #2 though. Not everyone will be here all day, every day. I have an idea, which was partially used in my game:

In my game, I was briefly away, and Hammered took over for a bit, and just basically posted night. This got me to thinking. If someone tries to be here as much as possible, but might not make it, perhaps having a second person in charge could help. You know, post night, perhaps day, if there isn't anything too complicated. Maybe a vote count every now and then. However, a some things must have to happen:

1) The Co-Host, Second-In-Charge, whatever you want to call it, can't be playing in the game. That person will have a look to the roles, etc., and if that person were to play in the game... Well, I don't even need to say it.

2) There has to be a limit. The Co-Host can't run the entire game! Perhaps one day/night, and if a very good excuse is PMed to the Co-Host, and perhaps Hammered or Jamul, more then that. However, if a certain amount of time is passed, and the Host is not back without an excuse, a punishment might have to be made. The equivalent of lurking would work.

3) The Host might have to have separate signups for the Co-Host, maybe in the original signup topic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AtkinsSJ View Post
I haven't liked the whole organised list thing from the start. It prevented squabbles, but I just have a real dislike of attempts to control things.

Anyway, more relevantly, mafia gets more broken as time goes on, and I can think of a few possible reasons:
  1. People are getting bored of vanilla mafia, so more unusual roles and game mechanics are tried, which haven't been tested because of the long waiting list.
  2. Some people are getting too good at mafia, so as we get new, less experienced players in, an effort is made to level the field, similarly to #1.
  3. People have to wait so long to host that they want to make their games memorable, and they have forever to invent complicated things that can happen in their game.
  4. There are few good hosts, and their games are few and far between, because of the list.
So, um, I'm getting very ranty, and I didn't intend to be. And most of this is ranting against the list, and the list is possibly a necessary evil. Please, anyone feel free to argue against me and pick holes. I just think mafia is dying.
As PCR said before: NO! Mafia must live on! It's big part of this forum. (Not as much as Hamumu Games and Dumb Topics, but still a big part) Just because a few problems are happening is no reason to stop it. It's been going on for so long, it just seems normal for Hamumu to have mafia games. It where people can be creative, and try many things. I wouldn't say it is dying. More games are a little broken, but that's because new users are playing, and I bet when most people first started playing, they weren't very good. Everyone has to start somewhere. My first game was almost hopelessly broken, but my second game was something else altogether. It was dramatically improved, for several reasons. Hosting is fun! Playing is fun! There may be squabbles every now and then, but these things happen.
Umm... What was my point again? Oh right. Mafia's good. Go mafia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coolguy View Post
Split the list in 2- A set of games for experienced players and a set of ones for inexperienced ones. Then the new players will still have a chance to win / learn how to play the game on their own, and the more experienced players won't have to fight with players that just bandwagon or lurk. This could help with Atkins' problems 2-4, as only experienced hosts could sign up for the experienced league list. Both lists would be smaller, although each game would probably have less players.
This setting could work. Everyone would be in their own field here. After more games are played, maybe new players could join old players, if they feel ready. Or, if an old player feels like a less hectic or strange game, they could join a game hosted by a new person.
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Old 12-09-2007, 12:21 PM   #24
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Default Re: How do we speed mafia up?

Frankly, I think the quality of the games should not be lowered simply to finish the game quicker and to get on with the next one.

Splitting the list in two is fine. It could take care of any hosting complaints while not hurrying the game. But I don't want to see any of the games being hurryed up simply for the sake of finishing it.
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Old 12-09-2007, 12:24 PM   #25
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Yerfdog Re: How do we speed mafia up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PurpleKoopa2000 View Post
Frankly, I think the quality of the games should not be lowered simply to finish the game quicker and to get on with the next one.
It's not that quality is being lowered, it's just that players are left sitting waiting for the host a lot in games. I don't see how that increases the quality.

If you're talking about things like day deadlines and such, I agree, but I don't think the current conversation is talking about that.
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Old 12-09-2007, 12:34 PM   #26
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Default Re: How do we speed mafia up?

Yes, splitting the list in two will speed up the games by having fewer players in each game and hosts will get more frequent turns because twice as many games will be happening. Hopefully, the net effect of the two combined will bring the wait time for hosting down from around 8 months to around 2 months.

Day deadlines are always very bad for the town, because a full majority is not required when it is near the end of the day, and all the mafia can pile onto one person right before the end of the day and prevail without a need for any kind of quality play on their part.
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Old 12-09-2007, 01:13 PM   #27
Roland
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Default Re: How do we speed mafia up?

Honestly, the idea that we should split into two factions is a...

Great one? I really, to be honest, think there are becoming a lot of newbies, and logic sometimes is voided, simply because person X, doing that move, which should have great weight in suggesting they are mafia, doesn't, and it's because they are newbies.

The two groups works because it allows newbies to still play, because we can't have that catch-22 phrase, "You can't play unless you've played 3 games already".

Wait, we're talking about hosting? Oh, well this benefits that greatly as well. But while we're on the subject, these are two main things that need to be sped up:

1) Nights - I have an idea: A 24 hour deadline, and if you don't get your PM in within that 24 hours, the host selects it randomly. If it's something like a one-shot item, they don't select it at all, and other stuff like that, etc.

2) Days - Less lurkers. Lurkers just jump on bandwagons and lurk in the day, not doing anything. There has to be some kind of strict day-replacing system set up.
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Old 12-10-2007, 12:54 PM   #28
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Default Re: How do we speed mafia up?

I moved the two league post over to Non-Hamumu games, where this sort of discussion belongs. If you wish to address that topic, please continue the discussion here: http://www.hamumu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14319

... and please PM me your opinions if you haven't done so already. I am fairly close to making a decision on who gets assigned to which team, and I don't want to overlook anyone. Details are in that thread.
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Old 12-10-2007, 01:51 PM   #29
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Default Re: How do we speed mafia up?

You could do what MafiaScum does, even though most of their games last the better part of 6 months... have a secondary host and hard deadlines. If the host goes missing, the secondary host takes over (Hammered's been doing this). I also think we should break up mafia games into 2 parts... shorter games, with <10 players, and longer games, with a different sign up for each. They're both entirely different beasts.
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Old 12-10-2007, 01:57 PM   #30
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Default Re: How do we speed mafia up?

That doesn't work, because we've only had 3 games with over 16 players.
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